The condemnation of abortion is an infallible doctrine of the Catholic Church equal in authority to all the Marian dogmas and the founding of the Catholic Church by Christ.
@chris griffin God Bless You for humbling yourself in your apology! It took courage! I'm sure the Holy Trinity as well as Our Blessed Mother Mary are pleased with you for doing so.
John 7:18
“He who speaks on his own authority seeks his own glory, but he who seeks the Glory of the One who sent him is true, and there is no unrighteousness in him.”
@chris griffin
Do you NOT realize the astounding hypocrisy in that you refuse to believe
these very words you quoted as follows:
" or by its ordinary and universal Magisterium, which in fact is manifested by the common adherence of Christ’s faithful under the guidance of the sacred Magisterium."
"These doctrines are contained in the word of God, written or handed down, and defined with a solemn judgement as divinely revealed truths either by the Roman Pontiff when he speaks 'ex cathedra,' or by the College of Bishops gathered in council, or infallibly proposed for belief by the ordinary and universal Magisterium."
Read what the popes state which you need to understand about your own hypocrisy regarding the Ordinary Magisterium which you attempt to oblige on others and yet do not oblige on yourself -
Mary, the Mother of ALMIGHTY GOD is The …
Ordinary Magisterium: The teaching office of the hierarchy under the Pope, exercised normally, that is, through the regular means of instructing the faithful. These means are all the usual channels of communication, whether written, spoken, or practical. When the ordinary magisterium is also universal, that is, collectively intended for all the faithful, it is also infallible.
Extraordinary Magisterium: The Church’s teaching office exercised in a solemn way, as in formal declarations of the Pope or of ecumenical councils of bishops approved by the Pope. When the extraordinary magisterium takes the form of papal definitions or conciliar decisions binding on the consciences of all the faithful in matters of faith and morals, it is infallible.
The above information about Ordinary and Extraordinary and other helpful information is found here-
Can the Ordinary Magisterium Err? – Part 1 | The …
@Faith Hope Charity....Your astounding ignorance is getting tiring. The Blessed Mother has 4 Catholic dogmas, NO MORE. What pope write as their opinion is nothing more than opinion and opinions are not binding nor dogmas.
@Faith Hope Charity... I do apologize to you, I value you as a friend and I went overboard, I am sorry and ask your forgiveness. I realize that you have fascination/devotion with The Blessed Mother to a degree that I do not have.
I have never told anyone my beliefs about apparitions, but I will tell you so that we may understand better. I will start preparing it. Thank you and God Bless you.
Praise, Honor, Glory, and Thanks be to ALMIGHTY GOD, and our QUEEN MOTHER of GOD, our Blessed Mother, Mary.
We have included praying for you, chris griffin, in our daily Holy Rosary together, and this morning, I was inspired to pray the 4th decade of the Sorrowful Mysteries for you regarding you carrying your own cross.
Thank you, Blessed Mother for your love for chris griffin. Thank you also for helping to strengthen me to persevere in this because of your love for him.
There are many false apparitions, and the Catholic Church approved ones which were before our present times of the counterfeit church of bergoglio and prevost which have been approved by the TRUE Catholic Church and popes which are the true apparitions for belief; as well, are ALL the Truths revealed by the valid popes of their infallible teachings of the ordinary and universal magisterium versus the counterfeit church of these times and their evils.
Archbishop Vigano expresses the truth well in this-
exsurgedomine.it/251208-reparatrix-eng/
GOD bless you always and in all ways, chris griffin, and thanks for the apology.
One must make a distinction between "divinely revealed" DOGMA - which can ONLY be known through divine revelation - and infallibly defined DOCTRINE - which can be declared by the Church and also known by "right reason." The Church's teaching against abortion is certainly TRUTH and condemns an intrinsic EVIL. BUT even non-believers of "good will" using reason, can deduce that is gravely wrong to murder innocent human life!
@Orthocat True. I am just happy that Pope John Paul 2 made it infallible so there would not be any doubters. Thanks.
Exodus 20:13
"You shall not kill".
@Tisbe Galaad Yes you quoted the 5th commandment in Exodus. God wrote it in stone. Thank you.
@chris griffin I agree that abortion is a horrible moral sin. I read each of the 255 infallibly defined dogmas of the Catholic Church and did not see abortion in any of them. Can you point me to the infallible dogma that you are refering to? When it comes to apparitions, for those who believe no proof is necessary and for those who do not believe, no proof is ever enough.
@frawley... Curiosity wants me to ask you what 225 dogmas did you read that does not include the condemnation of abortion. Why would you be unsure of this infallible condemnation since it directly follows the 5th Commandment Thou shall Not Murder. I had no idea that "faithful" Catholics did not know this. Also your old, worn-out cliche at the end is not helpful.
Here it is...
To the truths of the first paragraph belong the articles of faith of the Creed, the various christological dogmas21 and marian dogmas;22the doctrine of the institution of the sacraments by Christ and their efficacy with regard to grace;23the doctrine of the real and substantial presence of Christ in the Eucharist24and the sacrificial nature of the eucharistic celebration;25the foundation of the Church by the will of Christ;26the doctrine on the primacy and infallibility of the Roman Pontiff;27 the doctrine on the existence of original sin;28the doctrine on the immortality of the spiritual soul and on the immediate recompense after death;29the absence of error in the inspired sacred texts;30the doctrine on the grave immorality of direct and voluntary killing of an innocent human being.31
PROFESSION OF FAITH…
31 Cf. John Paul II, Encyclical Letter Evangelium Vitae, 57: AAS 87 (1995), 465.
Pope John Paul 2 actually made it infallible twice in Evangelium Vitae. The first is paragraph 57 as noted in the reference 31 and also 62 which I added below as further proof.
Paragraph 62…
Therefore, by the authority which Christ conferred upon Peter and his Successors, in communion with the Bishops-who on various occasions have condemned abortion and who in the aforementioned consultation, albeit dispersed throughout the world, have shown unanimous agreement concerning this doctrine-I declare that direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, always constitutes a grave moral disorder, since it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church's Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium. No circumstance, no purpose, no law whatsoever can ever make licit an act which is intrinsically illicit, since it is contrary to the Law of God which is written in every human heart, knowable by reason itself, and proclaimed by the Church.
Most Catholics are like you, ignorant of the infallible condemnation and that abortion should be regarded as seriously as the founding of the Catholic Church by Christ which you never do.
@frawley...The Catechism of the Catholic Church teaches that apparitions are private revelations. They may help believers live out the faith more deeply, but they are not part of the deposit of faith and Catholics are not required to believe them.
@chris griffin Chris I think that you do not fully understand "infallibly defined dogma". We as Catholics are required to believe many things outside of infallibly defined dogmas such as scripture, the ten commandments, the catechism ect. I think you used the term improperly. I think we ALL agree that abortion is a very grave mortal sin.
@frawley .... You are not allowed to define the meaning of infallible dogmas to fit your personal beliefs. That is dangerous to your soul.
1. This is my exact quote that you are disputing…”The condemnation of abortion is an infallible doctrine of the Catholic Church equal in authority to all the Marian dogmas and the founding of the Catholic Church by Christ.”
This is an official list of Vatican infallible dogmas…
“To the truths of the first paragraph belong the articles of faith of the Creed, the various christological dogmas21 and marian dogmas;22the doctrine of the institution of the sacraments by Christ and their efficacy with regard to grace;23the doctrine of the real and substantial presence of Christ in the Eucharist24and the sacrificial nature of the eucharistic celebration;25the foundation of the Church by the will of Christ;26the doctrine on the primacy and infallibility of the Roman Pontiff;27 the doctrine on the existence of original sin;28the doctrine on the immortality of the spiritual soul and on the immediate recompense after death;29the absence of error in the inspired sacred texts;30the doctrine on the grave immorality of direct and voluntary killing of an innocent human being.31
31 Cf. John Paul II, Encyclical Letter Evangelium Vitae, 57: AAS 87 (1995), 465.
Plus Paragraph 62…
Therefore, by the authority which Christ conferred upon Peter and his Successors, in communion with the Bishops-who on various occasions have condemned abortion and who in the aforementioned consultation, albeit dispersed throughout the world, have shown unanimous agreement concerning this doctrine-I declare that direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, always constitutes a grave moral disorder, since it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church's Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium. No circumstance, no purpose, no law whatsoever can ever make licit an act which is intrinsically illicit, since it is contrary to the Law of God which is written in every human heart, knowable by reason itself, and proclaimed by the Church.
My quote and the Vatican listing match up 100%, that cannot be denied. I have underlined the 3 dogmas in question that are all infallible.
You have no right to question the Vatican list of infallibles or change their meaning or interpretation.
5. The first paragraph states: "With firm faith, I also believe everything contained in the word of God, whether written or handed down in Tradition, which the Church, either by a solemn judgement or by the ordinary and universal Magisterium, sets forth to be believed as divinely revealed". The object taught in this paragraph is constituted by all those doctrines of divine and catholic faith which the Church proposes as divinely and formally revealed and, as such, as irreformable.11
These doctrines are contained in the word of God, written or handed down, and defined with a solemn judgement as divinely revealed truths either by the Roman Pontiff when he speaks 'ex cathedra,' or by the College of Bishops gathered in council, or infallibly proposed for belief by the ordinary and universal Magisterium.
These doctrines require the assent of theological faith by all members of the faithful. Thus, whoever obstinately places them in doubt or denies them falls under the censure of heresy, as indicated by the respective canons of the Codes of Canon Law.
Okay sure, but I don't have to beIeive in it do I! It is not a dogma is it? If you think it is then you can show evidence to prove your private belief, right?
@Jeffrey Ade
Here is the Vatican Profession of Faith showing that the condemnation of abortion is listed alongside all the Marion dogmas and the founding of the Catholic Church by Christ…
PROFESSION OF FAITH…
11. Examples. Without any intention of completeness or exhaustiveness, some examples of doctrines relative to the three paragraphs described above can be recalled.
To the truths of the first paragraph belong the articles of faith of the Creed, the various christological dogmas21 and marian dogmas;22the doctrine of the institution of the sacraments by Christ and their efficacy with regard to grace;23the doctrine of the real and substantial presence of Christ in the Eucharist24and the sacrificial nature of the eucharistic celebration;25the foundation of the Church by the will of Christ;26the doctrine on the primacy and infallibility of the Roman Pontiff;27 the doctrine on the existence of original sin;28the doctrine on the immortality of the spiritual soul and on the immediate recompense after death;29the absence of error in the inspired sacred texts;30the doctrine on the grave immorality of direct and voluntary killing of an innocent human being.31
31 Cf. John Paul II, Encyclical Letter Evangelium Vitae, 57: AAS 87 (1995), 465. Pope John
Pope John Paul 2 actually made it infallible twice in Evangelium Vitae. The first is paragraph 57 as noted in the reference 31 and also 62 which I added below as further proof.
Paragraph 62…
Therefore, by the authority which Christ conferred upon Peter and his Successors, in communion with the Bishops-who on various occasions have condemned abortion and who in the aforementioned consultation, albeit dispersed throughout the world, have shown unanimous agreement concerning this doctrine-I declare that direct abortion, that is, abortion willed as an end or as a means, always constitutes a grave moral disorder, since it is the deliberate killing of an innocent human being. This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church's Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium. No circumstance, no purpose, no law whatsoever can ever make licit an act which is intrinsically illicit, since it is contrary to the Law of God which is written in every human heart, knowable by reason itself, and proclaimed by the Church.
Most Catholics are like you ignorant of the infallible condemnation and abortion should be regarded as seriously as the founding of the Catholic Church by Christ which you never do.
You do not know infallible doctrine from optional beliefs. The Catechism of the Catholic Church (CCC 67) explicitly states that private revelations, including apparitions, “do not belong to the deposit of faith” and therefore belief in them is non-obligatory. Catholics are free to accept them if the Church judges them authentic, but they are never mandatory for salvation. In contrast, denying the condemnation of abortion is heresy against the Catholic Church.
@Jeffrey Ade
You are in a very dangerous position.....(all below is on the same page and applicable to you.
(5) Code of Canon Law, Canon 750 – Those things are to be believed by divine and catholic faith which are contained in the word of God as it has been written or handed down by tradition, that is, in the single deposit of faith entrusted to the Church, and which are at the same time proposed as divinely revealed either by the solemn Magisterium of the Church, or by its ordinary and universal Magisterium, which in fact is manifested by the common adherence of Christ’s faithful under the guidance of the sacred Magisterium. All are therefore bound to avoid any contrary doctrines.
These doctrines require the assent of theological faith by all members of the faithful. Thus, whoever obstinately places them in doubt or denies them falls under the censure of heresy, as indicated by the respective canons of the Codes of Canon Law.12
These doctrines are contained in the word of God, written or handed down, and defined with a solemn judgement as divinely revealed truths either by the Roman Pontiff when he speaks 'ex cathedra,' or by the College of Bishops gathered in council, or infallibly proposed for belief by the ordinary and universal Magisterium.
These doctrines require the assent of theological faith by all members of the faithful. Thus, whoever obstinately places them in doubt or denies them falls under the censure of heresy, as indicated by the respective canons of the Codes of Canon Law.12
Such doctrines can be defined solemnly by the Roman Pontiff when he speaks 'ex cathedra' or by the College of Bishops gathered in council, or they can be taught infallibly by the ordinary and universal Magisterium of the Church as a 'sententia definitive tenenda'.14 Every believer, therefore, is required to give firm and definitive assent to these truths, based on faith in the Holy Spirit's assistance to the Church's Magisterium, and on the Catholic doctrine of the infallibility of the Magisterium in these matters.15 Whoever denies these truths would be in a position of rejecting a truth of Catholic doctrine16 and would therefore no longer be in full communion with the Catholic Church.
"or by its ordinary and universal Magisterium, which in fact is manifested by the common adherence of Christ’s faithful under the guidance of the sacred Magisterium." I believe that!
@Jeffrey Ade the condemnation of abortion is listed with the Marian dogmas and the founding of the Catholic church by Christ...they are in the same category you cannot deny that.
You are wrong...i already have shown you paragraph 62 which explains what the Pope wrote....It follows the 5th commandment how could it not be infallible!
"This doctrine is based upon the natural law and upon the written Word of God, is transmitted by the Church's Tradition and taught by the ordinary and universal Magisterium." paragraph 62